How to get a gloss finish on my 3D printed mould

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How to get a gloss finish on my 3D printed mould

How to get a gloss finish on my 3D printed mould

Author	Message
Matteo Dapporto	M Matteo Dapporto posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
M Group: Forum Members Posts: 10, Visits: 77	Good afternoon In the last month I've done several tests and I want to share with you my journey! I have done several samples and I've used S120 and Marbocote HP1000N (same product of HP2002) sealers. S120 Easy Composite S120 cannot be applied directly to 3D printed mould because it doesn't stick to it. I've coated the samples with XTC-3D resin and sand it with 1200 grit sandpaper and I've airbrushed the sample with S120. The result is a very good gloss finished surface. I didn't use this method on my mould because I don't have enough S120 for all my moulds but I think the result I would get will be OK for my purpose. HP1000N (or HP2002) Marbocote I have made a sample by spraying the HP1000N directly on ABS. I've sanded the sample before apply the product. Here the result: The gloss finish is OK but I was worried about the strenght: after one manufacturing test I have seen that the sample surface has the footprint of the carbon fiber. So I've decided to use the same method I've used with S120: sand the sample, apply the XTC-3D resin, sand it and apply the HP1000N with an airbrush. The way to apply the HP1000N is tricky: if you apply 3 or 4 thin coats and the last one very wet you don't get the same gloss finish if you apply only one wet coat. Here a comparison picture of the 2 methods: The mould on the bottom side is the one with 3 / 4 light coats + 1 wet coat; it's clearly matte compare to the other one. The problem with the gloss finish mould is that the HP1000N starts to fade away after 4 or 5 usage. So I think the quantity I've applied is not enough or it has not stick to the mould properly. Here the "damaged" mould: I've tried to apply a second coat after a first wet one but the surface had some "hazy areas" so I've stopped to do that. I'm not sure how I can proceed now: I'm tempted to use the mould to get a resin one like Hanaldo wrote but I would like to explore more these 3D moulds but it's not easy as it looks. I'm printing a new PLA mould right now and I'm tempted to try to apply the HP1000N directly on it. I'm afraid that it can be damaged immediately as I've seen on the ABS sample. I'm pressing the moulds with 200Kg and I'm not sure if I can reduce it. I've just read about using 2K clear coat spray to seal the mould. Maybe if I brush my mould with some resin and then spray a 2K clear coat I can get a gloss and strong finish. Hanaldo wrote that I can get a better gloss finish compare to the one I'm getting by using Marbocote HP1000N. As usual your comments and advices are more than welcome!! Cheers Matteo Edited 7 Years Ago by Matteo Dapporto
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f1rob	f1rob posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
Group: Forum Members Posts: 237, Visits: 4.8K	+x Matteo Dapporto - 10/11/2018 6:56:11 PM +x f1rob - 10/11/2018 4:58:36 PM +x Matteo Dapporto - 10/11/2018 2:16:52 PM +x f1rob - 10/11/2018 2:09:44 PM Use marbocote 2002 Print your mould Rub the lines out Apply 6-10 coats of 2002 depending on the porosity of the part (Can oven between coats) We nib an smooth with 1200 paper Apply one last very wet coat an let dry naturally You will have a mirror like Finnish ( thou you can still polish more) that will be good for anything up to 125deg pre preg For ultimate shine ( and at a lower temp) use a wax release like freewax from freecote Thanks! Does 2002 stick to ABS and PLA materials? Because in the tech spec it's not mentioned. MAtteo Well so far it's worked on every single bit we have done but we make parts for lots of different teams who won't say what they use So if I well understood the moulds that you are sealing with HP2002 sealer are made by "plastic material".... All parts are 3d printed,what they are printed with is a mystery ! But 2002 has worked with everything so far
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scottracing	scottracing posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
Group: Forum Members Posts: 460, Visits: 5.2K	Yes they are a plastic material, sometimes they are wrapped very carefully in ptfe tape. Which is a lot of fun on pipework. Ive used marbocote on pla and abs and it has released but pla is only good for 60 degrees max and abs isnt that much better. Maybe 80 to 90 at a push.
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Matteo Dapporto	M Matteo Dapporto posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
M Group: Forum Members Posts: 10, Visits: 77	+x f1rob - 10/11/2018 4:58:36 PM +x Matteo Dapporto - 10/11/2018 2:16:52 PM +x f1rob - 10/11/2018 2:09:44 PM Use marbocote 2002 Print your mould Rub the lines out Apply 6-10 coats of 2002 depending on the porosity of the part (Can oven between coats) We nib an smooth with 1200 paper Apply one last very wet coat an let dry naturally You will have a mirror like Finnish ( thou you can still polish more) that will be good for anything up to 125deg pre preg For ultimate shine ( and at a lower temp) use a wax release like freewax from freecote Thanks! Does 2002 stick to ABS and PLA materials? Because in the tech spec it's not mentioned. MAtteo Well so far it's worked on every single bit we have done but we make parts for lots of different teams who won't say what they use So if I well understood the moulds that you are sealing with HP2002 sealer are made by "plastic material"....
	Reply Like 2
f1rob	f1rob posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
Group: Forum Members Posts: 237, Visits: 4.8K	+x Matteo Dapporto - 10/11/2018 2:16:52 PM +x f1rob - 10/11/2018 2:09:44 PM Use marbocote 2002 Print your mould Rub the lines out Apply 6-10 coats of 2002 depending on the porosity of the part (Can oven between coats) We nib an smooth with 1200 paper Apply one last very wet coat an let dry naturally You will have a mirror like Finnish ( thou you can still polish more) that will be good for anything up to 125deg pre preg For ultimate shine ( and at a lower temp) use a wax release like freewax from freecote Thanks! Does 2002 stick to ABS and PLA materials? Because in the tech spec it's not mentioned. MAtteo Well so far it's worked on every single bit we have done but we make parts for lots of different teams who won't say what they use
	Reply Like 3
Matteo Dapporto	M Matteo Dapporto posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
M Group: Forum Members Posts: 10, Visits: 77	+x f1rob - 10/11/2018 2:09:44 PM Use marbocote 2002 Print your mould Rub the lines out Apply 6-10 coats of 2002 depending on the porosity of the part (Can oven between coats) We nib an smooth with 1200 paper Apply one last very wet coat an let dry naturally You will have a mirror like Finnish ( thou you can still polish more) that will be good for anything up to 125deg pre preg For ultimate shine ( and at a lower temp) use a wax release like freewax from freecote Thanks! Does 2002 stick to ABS and PLA materials? Because in the tech spec it's not mentioned. MAtteo
	Reply Like 3
f1rob	f1rob posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
Group: Forum Members Posts: 237, Visits: 4.8K	Use marbocote 2002 Print your mould Rub the lines out Apply 6-10 coats of 2002 depending on the porosity of the part (Can oven between coats) We nib an smooth with 1200 paper Apply one last very wet coat an let dry naturally You will have a mirror like Finnish ( thou you can still polish more) that will be good for anything up to 125deg pre preg For ultimate shine ( and at a lower temp) use a wax release like freewax from freecote
	Reply Like 4
Matteo Dapporto	M Matteo Dapporto posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
M Group: Forum Members Posts: 10, Visits: 77	+x Steve Broad - 10/10/2018 12:33:17 AM I agree with Hanaldo. If I tried this method, I would CNC the moulds in aluminium. It is easy to machine, hard wearing and polishes to a glossy finish easily. They look pretty straightforward so a basic 2.5D mill would make this very accurately with no problem. I've asket a quotation for CNC moulds to a local supplier and the price is 600€. The 3D mould material cost me around 7€ plus some hours of work to polish it. I think for a small production like mine the mould price is quite important. For sure I will not get the best appearance as I can get by using a CNC mould but it's ok for me to get what I can get from a 3D mould. Regards Matteo
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Matteo Dapporto	M Matteo Dapporto posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
M Group: Forum Members Posts: 10, Visits: 77	+x Hanaldo - 10/10/2018 12:11:45 AM The glossy image of primer is just after it has been sprayed while the primer is still wet. This gloss backs off and it dries to a satin finish, not unlike what you already have. You can get good pattern coatings where you can prime it and then apply a gloss coating, or mix the two together to get an in between result. This is an option for you, but wont work with ABS - ABS is quite a vulnerable plastic, and also difficult to bond to. It's also this reason that makes me doubt S120 would work. Yes, you would need to polish the fibreglass mould, but fiberglass moulds generally take polishing very well if you use the right materials. Dont get me wrong, I have great respect for additive manufacturing. But for me it is still more of a prototyping solution, I'm yet to be convinced that it is great for direct printing of tooling, at least not in the traditional sense anyway. 3D printing mandrels and dissolvable cores, fine; there isnt currently a much better solution for that. But for the part you are making, in the way that you are making it - 3D printing the mould isnt the way to go about it for me. Thanks for your post. You are right: S120 doesn't stick to ABS and in general to all the plastics surfaces. This is the answer I've got from EC: "We do not recommend S120 for use on most hard plastic surfaces, including ABS. This is because the surfaces, even when keyed, do not offer a good level of adhesive grip for the sealer. " I've 3D printed some plates and I'm trying to coat them with gelcoat and epoxy resin and when I'll get the S120 I will try to apply it of these samples and I will see if I can get gloss carbon fiber part. If I will not get it I will paint my CF part with some paint to get the gloss finish. Thanks for your help! Matteo
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Steve Broad	Steve Broad posted 7 Years Ago HOT Post Details
Group: Forum Members Posts: 408, Visits: 4.1K	I agree with Hanaldo. If I tried this method, I would CNC the moulds in aluminium. It is easy to machine, hard wearing and polishes to a glossy finish easily. They look pretty straightforward so a basic 2.5D mill would make this very accurately with no problem.
	Reply Like 3