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Cheaper Mould alternatives?
Cheaper Mould alternatives?
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Junior
Junior
posted 8 Years Ago
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I want to make a 2-part mould roughly covering 3.5sqmtrs but the overall cost is quite large.
Would it be possible to use a cheaper alternative to the Uni-mould Tooling resin (which appears to be the most expensive part) such as a cheap Polyester resin to bond all the layers of chopped strand mat? Or is there another cheaper alternative to the uni-mould system that would give adequate results?
I don't intend on pulling hundreds of releases, at most I would say 5 in total?
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Hanaldo
Hanaldo
posted 8 Years Ago
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FLD (21/04/2017)
Regarding the whole warping issue, I've used the materials you linked for a 1/2 car sized mould without loss of shape or dimension. In my head I consider the resin to exotherm as it cures so it turns solid in a hot state. Cooling that solid then makes it shrink. If you can do individual layers and allow them to cure you stop it getting hot so it doesn't shrink. I suspect warping comes about from hotter areas as they've been made thicker so any contraction is then uneven. A little care is all that's required.
Not quite as simple as that; effectively all you are doing is controlling the shrinkage to its minimum. Resins shrink due to the presence of uncross-linked free radicals after the polymerization stage (read: after the resin has turned to a solid). Regular unsaturated polyester resins typically have the highest percentage of uncross-linked free radicals, vinyl esters and epoxies have slightly less due to the presence of the more reactive epoxy groups. Polyesters can shrink as much as 7% by volume, vinyl esters are closer to 3%, and epoxies are >1%.
The reason you get more shrinkage when the exotherm gets too high or you have too much catalyst is because the free radicals are actually produced before the resin gels. Cross-linking takes place between the gelled stage and the solid stage, and it requires the free radicals to be able to move around. If the exotherm gets too hot or there is too much catalyst, then the movement of the free radicals is slowed and the reaction stops before many of the free radicals can cross-link, leaving you with a higher percentage of uncross-linked monomers and thus a higher rate of shrinkage.
In short, ALL resins shrink, it's just how polymerization works. Polyester tooling resins actually shrink just as much as regular polyester resins, but they are filled with a thermoplastic additive that expands at the same rate that the resin shrinks, thus giving almost truly zero shrinkage (0.00-0.1% volume).
I think the important thing is how much shrinkage you can actually tolerate. Especially at hobby level, the tolerance for shrinkage is generally pretty high, you aren't working to thousandths of a mm and for the most part you probably aren't going to care if there's a bit of print-through.
Apologies for the chemistry lecture, I hope others find it as interesting as I do!
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Cheaper Mould alternatives?
Junior
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8 Years Ago
I use regular polyester almost all the time. You just need to watch it for shrinkage. Build it up a...
FLD
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8 Years Ago
Thanks for the reply, would you still require the barrier layer (coupling coat?) between the gelcoat...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
No need for a specific coupling coat either; but it's good practice to do the same light-weight...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
Excellent stuff, that has reduced the overall cost massively! I think I would prefer to use a proper...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
A rapid tooling system like Unimould will produce a much better mould than regular GP laminating...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
Are you going to use the mold to produce carbon parts? The i would highly recommend to make a test...
oekmont
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8 Years Ago
[quote]Are you going to use the mold to produce carbon parts? [/quote] Unsure, may do a fibreglass...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
[quote][b]oekmont (21/04/2017)[/b][hr]Are you going to use the mold to produce carbon parts? The i...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
If the description is true (I guess it is): A: the unimold tooling resin is vinylester based, wich...
oekmont
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8 Years Ago
[quote] B: the coupling coat seems to be a chemical bond between the surface vinylester resin and...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
Thanks Hanaldo, yes this will just be a hobby project so time is not critical and I will not need...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
Yes, i think you will need the coupling coat if you use the unimould gelcoat.. Unimould and Epoxy...
Dravis
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8 Years Ago
So what would you guys recommendas a cheaper 'hobby' alternative?
Junior
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8 Years Ago
GP resin is fine mate, it is the cheaper alternative. Hell, even some big companies still build...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
[quote]GP resin is fine mate, it is the cheaper alternative[/quote] What about the gelcoat/coupling...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
[quote][b]Junior (21/04/2017)[/b][hr][quote]GP resin is fine mate, it is the cheaper...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
I would say it depends: If you are making a large part (the absolute shrinks depends on the mold...
oekmont
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8 Years Ago
The moulds will be used to make two halves of a kayak that will be joined together with composite...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
As you can correct the inaccuracies during the final bonding process this might work well with...
oekmont
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8 Years Ago
Would the following be suitable/compatible? I'm struggling to find anything cheaper.. Tooling...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
I buy stuff there but I wouldn't use the reblend resin. It is just the dregs stirred together....
FLD
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8 Years Ago
So would the top two work together or is there a better alternative? Did someone say you can use a...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
The top two work great, I use them myself. The general gelcoat you've just added works fine too (I...
FLD
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8 Years Ago
[quote][b]FLD (21/04/2017)[/b][hr] Regarding the whole warping issue, I've used the materials you...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
That's good to know it has worked for you, to be honest I'd only be looking to make 2-3 pulls, 5 at...
Junior
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8 Years Ago
I totally agree that thermal shrinkage could cause even more problems than chemical shrinkage. But...
oekmont
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8 Years Ago
[quote][b]oekmont (22/04/2017)[/b][hr]I totally agree that thermal shrinkage could cause even more...
Hanaldo
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8 Years Ago
I thought the chemistry was more complex than that? The chain propagation is also radical based as...
FLD
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8 Years Ago
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