Composite Noob


Author
Message
Jackjack.iot
Jackjack.iot
Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4, Visits: 14
Hey people!
 I'm Jack, I'm 23, a Software Engineer from the UK.. I'm madly in love with fast cars and in the quest to go faster, You gotta go lighter right?!
 
I'm here with a passion for composite materials, I've only ever made a few things up in fiberglass in the past but I'm looking to learn, build and understand how CF and other composites work.

As far as I understand it Wet-lay CF is the same process of Fiberglass, you use an epoxy resin baselayer and multiple layers of material on top which are subsequently "dabbed" in with more resin, Pre-preg / dry cf is more complex as it has the epoxy in the cloth and requires additional external forces to change it, this is what I want to learn about

My idea is to take my (somewhat mundane) Civic Sport and transform it, I've already performed the basics to my transformation; VTI-S lip kit, Better tyres, Uprated 4-pot calipers, Lowered over adjustable coilovers and other suspension modifications to make it handle better but in the near future I will be swapping to a K20A engine from the (EP3) Civic Type-R however while I'm at it I'm looking to change a few parts out like bonnet, wings and doorcard's with lighter alternative. Being as my model of Civic is not widely supported by manufacturers of composites like bonnets and wings I must either pay someone or do it myself.. I'm never one to settle for letting someone else do things for me so will be (attempting) to take on tasks of producing wings, a lip kit and even a bonnet of my car. 

I'm more than willing to take all the information and help I can get on the subject so if you have any info you're willing to share, post up! Smile 
davro
davro
Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)Supreme Being (2.6K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 300, Visits: 2.2K
Hi Jack, 

Lighter, Faster, Stronger, It's all about BHP per Ton Smile

An old work colleague/friend has a K swap civic, he is doing the UK Time attack it's an awesome piece of kit.


Resin infusion is a good starting place unless you have access to a big oven.
Being a software guy, like myself you might like some of my LinuxCNC and Fusion360 mould making stuff, that I'm trying to master.

Anyway Welcome to the forums, you have come to the right place, looking forward seeing to your projects



David Stevens
YouTubeComment | Rate | Subscribe
Instagram

Composite Projects
Body Package for Dax Rush
RC Car Touring Body 1/10 Scale


Edited 9 Years Ago by davro
Jackjack.iot
Jackjack.iot
Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4, Visits: 14
Hey there Davro,
 I belive I saw that EG at a few tracks over the years.. Been to Brands hatch a couple of times!

I sadly don't have access to a big enough oven that would allow me to make up parts such as bonnet etc so I guess infusion is going to be my option for now. I read somewhere that dry is 70% lighter than wet however I think wet is going to be much lighter than stock as it is (weighs like 31lb's / 14kg) so if I can atleast build a wet one and then keep the plugs around incase I ever get a chance to use a large oven.

Lighter Faster Stronger is definitely my motto! I had a CGA3DET (1.4 Turbo) Nissan March rally shell for amateur rallies which weighed 720kg kerb and made 183ft-lb/193hp at wheels. It was a handful but very very competitive in the unlimited class keeping toe-toe with scoobs! it had full fiberglass front and end (wings / bonnet / bumper) and rear hatch. We had as much weight removed where possible and safe!

I've just noticed you use DO as your host like me BigGrin I have access to a Makerbot 3D printer for small objects I might want to make in CF but if you don't mind telling me (in PM?) about this Linux CNC stuff I'd be more than interested BigGrin 
Hanaldo
Hanaldo
Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.5K, Visits: 28K
Haha man the terms 'wet' and 'dry' annoy me! Every composite has resin in it, they are all wet! 

Seriously though, there's absolutely no difference between an out-of-autoclave pre-preg (dry) part compared to an infused 'wet' part, provided they are well made. Both should have a fibre:resin ratio of around 60:40, which is quite ideal. 
f1rob
f1rob
Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)Supreme Being (2K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 237, Visits: 4.8K
You have a prepreg the resin content is set at the point on manufacture (even on "hot roll" OOA material so normally 34%

infusion is dependant on the person ,how they bag the job and you will be lucky to hit 40% all the time

yet to see a data sheet for a infusion resin that is anywhere near the figures for a prepreg resin system

Most prepregs can easily handles a 180 deg post cure after strip out for even more strengh
Hanaldo
Hanaldo
Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.5K, Visits: 28K
I've never come across an actual OOA pre-preg with less than 38% resin content. The good ones I've seen are 40%, and the one 38% one I've tried is garbage. 

Perhaps I should rephrase my statement and say that for your average hobbiest application, there's not going to be any difference between an infused panel and a pre-preg panel. Of course an advantage of pre-preg is it's Tg, but again, any good infusion resin can handle the temperatures required of a vehicle body panel. 

It's horses for courses obviously, don't get me wrong I love pre-preg for small parts and complex parts. For larger panels though, infusion wins all day long for me. It's a bloody annoying process and I've learned to hate it, but it works and it works well. 
Jackjack.iot
Jackjack.iot
Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4, Visits: 14
I feel utterly stupid asking this as I'm 99% the answer should be straight forward, if I make up panels (I thinking of Infusion/Wet here) and send my car for paint work with said panels fitted will I have any issues with them at all? I'm sure there shouldn't be any issues but We can never be too careful right? I don't want to ruin my lovely composite pieces after meticulously hand laying and making said items. 

I'm intending on doing things like lip kit, Bonnet and Wings in CF / CFxKevlar and getting the wings and bonnet painted in factory knighthawk black pearl when I send the car to be redone and a lip kit just lacquered  clear to show off a little bit of composite bling.
Hanaldo
Hanaldo
Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.5K, Visits: 28K
It's no problem painting composite parts provided the spray painters do their job properly. I taught myself to spray paint because I got sick of 'professionals' cutting corners. The only time I've ever had issues is when I've had a pro do the job. 

But provided you stress to them that they NEED to clean the parts and sand them meticulously, then there's no issues at all. 
Jackjack.iot
Jackjack.iot
Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)Junior Member (20 reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 4, Visits: 14
Hanaldo (15/08/2016)
It's no problem painting composite parts provided the spray painters do their job properly. I taught myself to spray paint because I got sick of 'professionals' cutting corners. The only time I've ever had issues is when I've had a pro do the job. 

But provided you stress to them that they NEED to clean the parts and sand them meticulously, then there's no issues at all. 


The company I use has a reputation for being meticulous, I've used them in the past to touch up an R32 GTR I own and my old Civic EK9 (Type-R) so I know they're good. I will have to build my panels first before I can think about getting the paint work done anyway!

Cheers Hanaldo!
Edited 9 Years Ago by Jackjack.iot
Hanaldo
Hanaldo
Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)Supreme Being (21K reputation)
Group: Forum Members
Posts: 2.5K, Visits: 28K
Yes, the painters I've used are also extremely good, they do the 20k paint jobs on our show cars with no problems. Thing is, painters are quite set in their ways and tend to treat everything the same. They don't realise that composite panels have been exposed to quite powerful release agents, and can in some cases be somewhat difficult to bond to. 

For example the one part I had painted, I knew I was going to paint it so I only finished the mould to 600 grit. The painter then thought that because it looked like it had a good surface for paint she didn't need to prep it (even though she charged me for the prep work). 

Anyway, I'm sure in most cases it would be absolutely fine, it's just something to be aware of and in my opinion worth stressing to them. 
GO

Merge Selected

Merge into selected topic...



Merge into merge target...



Merge into a specific topic ID...




Similar Topics

Reading This Topic

Explore
Messages
Mentions
Search