Am i dreaming?


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Jones
J
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So I'm getting fed up with the labour that comes with the layup time doing infusion of complicated parts and are on a missing to reduce that while still keeping the budget reasonable for a college student.
So im playing with the idea to moving over and use silicone bags instead as I intend on doing multiple parts. (possibly brush on silicone to keep spray equipments costs down)

And to be able to skip the whole peel ply, perforated release film and flow mesh deal as that is what is both time consuming and easy mess up and end up with bridging issues if not being careful. And to combat the flow properties in other ways, help me here. What are the factors I can play with?
-core material with flow properties. (out of the window because part has to be thin sub 1mm. using 650g C twill 45/45, 440g Glass 45/45 for flex length wise atm)
-structural flow media such as Fiberglass veil or CSM kind of stuff ( are there any good drape able alternatives here)
-leaving a low profile regular flow media on the part
-heating up the mold and the resin to reduce viscosity (using EC IN2 resin atm)
-figuring out smart ways to use permanent resin runners inside the silicone bag.
-simulate a grid/flow mesh like structure in the making of the silicone bag

anyways just thought it might be a fun idea to play with might be just stupid idk
here are some pictures of the part and mold doing it the old fashion way


oekmont
oekmont
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No, you are not dreaming. I was at exactly your point. My experiences are:
-usually it doesn't pay of, simply because of numbers.
-for bigger parts (25 or more cm flow path) a counter mould with slight overpressure at the inlet (I made a 10L pressure pot) works best.
- I usually make my smaller plugs with 3d printing. this gives the option to realize a 2mm/45° pyramid structure on the backside. With that I can create a silicone bag, with decent flow propertys. But this is obviously not possible for parts with a thickness under 2mm.

JasonFL
JasonFL
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Sounds to me like you’re wanting to go the RTM route.

Jason
Jones
J
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oekmont - 5/28/2019 2:36:59 PM
No, you are not dreaming. I was at exactly your point. My experiences are:
-usually it doesn't pay of, simply because of numbers.
-for bigger parts (25 or more cm flow path) a counter mould with slight overpressure at the inlet (I made a 10L pressure pot) works best.
- I usually make my smaller plugs with 3d printing. this gives the option to realize a 2mm/45° pyramid structure on the backside. With that I can create a silicone bag, with decent flow propertys. But this is obviously not possible for parts with a thickness under 2mm.

i have no idea what you mean by using a pressure pot but sure.
you are a genius so if I understand you right you basically make the printed plug the exact same thickness as the part you want to make and on top of that you add tiny pyramids all over the backside that are 2mm high? and make a regular fiberglass mold on the frontside? Are you using a fdm printer or something more fancy?

I mean strength is not mega important so do you know of any fabric or mesh that is of a low is profile? I could always skip the 440g  fiberglass layer and use resin filled mesh instead that is stuck to the topside of the part. 

Jones
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JasonFL - 5/28/2019 3:58:17 PM
Sounds to me like you’re wanting to go the RTM route.

I wish but the college budge is not going to like that. looking to scrap and cheat my way through it instead. 

oekmont
oekmont
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Pressure pot: I made a container, with an in and out connector each, wich can be bolted together. After mixing and degassing the resin I put the cup into the pressure pot, put the out hose into the cup and close and bolt the pressure pot. The out hose goes into the RTM light mould. Now I open the in hose valve, wich connects the pressure pot to a pressure control unit/compressor. During the process I usually keep the in pressure at atmospheric pressure for 2-3 minutes, and then rise it to 0,5bar overpressure for the rest of the process. When the infusion is completed, i decrease the pressure to 0,1 bar, to keep the thickness expansion of the cavity because of internal pressure at a low level.

I use a resin type printer if I can, because of better surface quality, but it is very limited in size. For medium models I use a fdm printer.

Do you know the mesh they use to keep dirt from falling off the scaffolding at construction? At least here in Germany they do. It's only 0,5mm in thickness, very plyable, very cheap and has about third to half the flow propertys of regular flow media. You can get it at Amazon or eBay. Keep in mind that leaving the flow media on will likely bend and twist thin parts.

GO

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