Containing loose carbon fiber fragments - layup problem


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f1rob
f1rob
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Nerd Lab - 8/3/2018 4:46:23 AM
We are casting a complex part with a lot of sharp and opposing angles, which has proven to be extremely difficult to accomplish with a single sheet layup. While we did close in on the goal, the method proved to be unsound. Changing methods, the best results have come from approaching the layup with multiple carbon fiber pieces. This required a lot of precise cuts and matching of weave, as you might imagine. The problem now is that we get stray, quite noticeable, carbon fiber 'fragments' in our parts. My question is to know if there is a way to apply some type of temporary backing to a section of non-prepreg roll which would keep the weave intact to allow me to cut and lay out the shapes I need and reduce stray fragments, then being able to peel off the backing upon layup.
There is one YouTube video of an Aussie showing how to apply a mix of PVA/H2O and thin 'paper' which dried as a backing which you can then peel off in layup. That didn't work for us. Is prepreg the only answer? I would also think that since we're spraying clear gel coat in the mold before layup, any PVA would ruin the bond between the resin and gel coat. Is there a resin soluble product that we could bond the carbon fiber and paper with? We also use spray adhesive to keep a couple of key parts in place which claims to dissolve in resin but that seems to risky.

The templates in the picture attached are a few of the shapes that we need perfect.
Thanks for any help,
Sr. Nerd Lab Technician 

Lay a sheet of plastic on the table ( I use vac bag)
Wet out with resin (squeege is best)
Place carbon on plastic
THROUGHLY wet out carbon
Placa 2nd sheet of plastic on top of carbon .
You can now mark your shapes out on the top sheet of plastic as you would pre preg.
Cut out with scissors
Remove top an bottom plastic just before applying to your job
Done right no stray fibres

Furrari
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Another idea would be to use a clear sellotape type tape ( clear not standard) where you are going to cut so that you have only 1/3 to 1/4 of the width of the tape left on your component.
Hanaldo
Hanaldo
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This will cause interlaminar bond issues ^ There are tapes made specifically for this like Airtech Airhold, but they are expensive and not really that useful.


The 'web-lock' brand of set-weave carbon you can get from Composite Envisions. I've heard good things about it compared to other set-weave fabrics, and it's like the Toray version - much softer than the others and uses a hot melt binder rather than the b-staged epoxy.

You don't really need it though, and you don't need an especially flexible fabric to tack to the back of your carbon, just tack two layers of carbon together. If you need more drape or conformability, cut the second layer so that the fibres are at 45 degrees - I find this is very rarely necessary.
drippy
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Hanaldo - 8/3/2018 10:24:16 PM
This will cause interlaminar bond issues ^ There are tapes made specifically for this like Airtech Airhold, but they are expensive and not really that useful.


The 'web-lock' brand of set-weave carbon you can get from Composite Envisions. I've heard good things about it compared to other set-weave fabrics, and it's like the Toray version - much softer than the others and uses a hot melt binder rather than the b-staged epoxy.

You don't really need it though, and you don't need an especially flexible fabric to tack to the back of your carbon, just tack two layers of carbon together. If you need more drape or conformability, cut the second layer so that the fibres are at 45 degrees - I find this is very rarely necessary.

That's good to know on the web-lock stuff cause they can do it to any fabric they sell and I was gonna make a run of hoods that the fins of the scoop were kevlar and the hood itself was carbon (just for aesthetics) but needed to keep the fabric together. I'm gonna get some ordered today to play around with it. 

Nerd Lab
Nerd Lab
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Thank you for the ideas and feedback. I'm going to put in an order for a few test yards of the web lock and the ProFinish, assuming that they have that in 11X11 to match up with the weave used by Tesla. 
The spray adhesive method worked out rather well when it came to using a scalpel for some of the shapes but the real test will be when I lay up some parts next week.

Thanks again all.
Edited 6 Years Ago by Nerd Lab
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