laminating resin "runs off"


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RyanParle
RyanParle
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I'm in the middle of my first attempt at carbon fibre laminating using the CarbonMods starter kit with the 100 to 30 ratio resin and when I apply the base coat of resin I cannot get it to keep an even coverage over the surface of the mould, it just wants to pool up at the bottom of the mould leaving dry patches on the angled faces.

Can anyone tell me what could be going wrong here? Is there anything I can do to put it right? The resin is still runny at the moment and i have tried to keep brushing it back from the bottom.
TomDesign
TomDesign
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Photos help always a lot.
RyanParle
RyanParle
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Sorry I cant seem to upload any images, posting this from my mobile. 
Ithink I may have got it sorted now, I waited until the resin had thickened up a little then gently brushed it back over the dodgy areas.

I'll let you know how I get on.
Edited 11 Years Ago by RyanParle
razuuk004
razuuk004
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That may be caused by not cleaning the surface area before applying the resin using Pre-cleaner surface and wax remover or, if you did use pre-cleaner, not removing it properly or not allowing it to evaporate before applying the resin. in any case, when that happens you can immediately remove the resin with acetone or laquer thinner and start over or, allow the first layer of resin to cure and apply subsequent layers over again. it will catch on the second or third try.
RyanParle
RyanParle
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I did not use any pre cleaner, it was not included in either the mould making or laminating starter kits i have. my precess was as follows:

after releasing pattern from mould i flatted back the gel coat with wet & dry from 600 grit up to 1200 grit, then polished with G3 polishing compound, Then applied 5 coats of Number 8 Mould Release Wax, followed by a coat of PVA Mould Release Agent, once it was dry i applied the resin and this is when i noticed the dry patches forming.

i waited for the resin to thicken up a little and gently brushed it back over the affected areas, in the end i had a pretty smooth layer.

I had a little difficulty in getting the first layer of carbon sheet in to the mould without it sticking to the resin before it was fully in the bottom of the mould, resulting in the weave being quite badly distorted on one face, fortunately that face will mostly be cut out for a grommet mounted led fog lamp. In hindsight i would have carefully folded the fabric and introduced it from a different angle allowing me to open it out into the mould.

I pulled the part from the mould this morning and i was pleasantly surprised at the finish, there are few dry spots but nothing that will be too visible & to be fair it is better than some parts i have paid a lot of money for from a motorsport supplier.
Edited 11 Years Ago by RyanParle
Matt (Staff)
Matt (Staff)
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Hi Ryan,

Thanks for your posts and for elaborating on your issue, process and the end result.

To be honest, what you've found is, in essence, quite normal. Particularly in warmer conditions you'll find that the resin is a lower viscosity than in cold conditions which makes the problem of it wanting to 'fish-eye' away from the repellent mould surface more pronounced.

The main reason for this phenomenon is that the laminating resin is a resin, and not a gelcoat. Gelcoats are like resins but they have thixotropic  additives to make them thicker (normally something like colloidal silica). In the Carbon Fibre Laminating Starter Kit however we do need to keep things fairly simple and so, although a dedicated gelcoat might make things easier in certain situations (warm conditions, highly waxed surfaces etc.) it would mean adding another resin, hardener and the associated cost and complication to the kit.

Very soon we'll be re-making the laminating kit video and making some changes to the laminating kit. Instead of using a single layer of resin as a gelcoat we'll probably suggest skipping this step and instead show people the best way to laminate without a gelcoat but still avoid (as best as possible) pin-holes in the surface of the part when doing this. In the meantime, you might want to have a go at laminating parts without a resin layer as a gelcoat down first yourself. One advantage to this is that you won't have the problem of the carbon sticking to the gelcoat layer as you position it in the mould.

If you're interested in improving the behavior of the resin when used as a gelcoat then you could consider purchasing some Colloidal Silica and then mixing it into some of the laminating resin to thicken it and make it behave more like a gelcoat or you could consider purchasing some GC50 which is our Epoxy Compatible Polyester Gelcoat - this product is probably the best way you can gelcoat an epoxy part (being polyester it's UV stable and highly polish-able and yet it's designed to be bonded to by epoxy which makes it the best of both worlds!).

I hope this information helps.

Best regards, Matt

Matt Statham
Easy Composites / Carbon Mods - Technical Sales
Edited 11 Years Ago by Matt (Staff)
RyanParle
RyanParle
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Thanks Matt.

I'm glad to see that i had followed the instructions correctly and that it is normal behaviour of the resin under these conditions.

I am also keen to know more about the process of laminating without the first coat of resin, the next part i have planned to make is quite a bit more complicated and it would certainly be easier to lay the fabric to a non sticky surface.

For those who are interested here are links to the finished item:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151801986912812&l=ff3043527b

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151801987037812&l=d98436234a
Edited 11 Years Ago by RyanParle
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